Fanfiction Tier List (w/ Julie Taylor Test), FE4 Gen1 [Take 2!]

[mark_asphodel]

Turns out the Gen 2 girls are kinda difficult to rate, so let's detour through Gen 1.

Not all of them mind.  Just some highlights.

Same rules as before.

Yer Lord:

The FE4 script gives us enough of an impression of Sigurd's inner life to let us know this guy is a good-hearted dim bulb.  When he takes the initiative, it's usually a bad idea.  When he goes into reactive mode, his reactions are usually wrong.  The only thing that gets his army out of Chapter 3 in one piece is the offer of rescue from Queen Rahna-- and, surprisingly, Sigurd seems at his best in the following chapter while fighting on her behalf.  But in Silesse, Rahna is Good People and the people against her are Bad People.  It's simple.  It's black and white, where the rest of the continent isn't.  There is no room for ambiguity and complexity in Sigurd's world.  Unintended consequences don't exist... until oops, they happen.  Right will prevail... until it doesn't.  People can be trusted right up until they murder everyone dear to you.  And so on.

Verdict: Actually, his inner life seems clear enough.  It's just not a particularly interesting place.  If Sigurd had a richer inner life he might not've ended up so dramatically dead.

Clear Inner Life:

Lewyn:
Can we agree Lewyn has the best writing of any of the Gen1 playables?  He has an actual, fully realized character arc that makes sense and feels plausible.  Gen2 Lewyn is essentially static-- he's already transformed to the extent that he must, and except for maybe a stray tear over Tiltyu, he's not developing beyond what we already see.  All the development is right there in Gen1, onscreen, as Lewyn goes from the kid who's running away from his responsibilities because he's afraid and the matured Forseti user who's decided to embrace his destiny.  

Verdict: We've got the pieces to put together what's going on in Lewyn's head right up 'til Bad Shit comes down.  Loves, hates, fears, uncertainties, and so on.

I'd also be inclined to put Quan&Ethlyn and maybe Azel into this category.  With Q&E I think we have enough on them to see exactly WHY they ended up as they did, and in Azel's case I think the handful of conversations we get out of him communicate things well enough.  And actually... Sylvia's not so bad once you get past the mistranslations.

Less Clear Inner Life:

Aideen: For the chick at the center of the action, there's a lot that doesn't make sense.  Why did she think becoming a nun would lead her to Briggid?  Has she really been carting around the Yewfelle for years?  Does she really not let Midir just call her "Aideen" until well after they've married?  How much does she really believe in her god(s)-- Claude sure seems more hardcore than she is.  How does she feel about the utter ruin of her family?  Skipping ahead to Gen 2, what's it like bringing up all those damn kids?  Why does the script indicate she didn't even tell the kids their own father's name?  (And I don't mean Lester's throwaway reference, I mean Lana's wtf conversation with Finn.)

Verdict: Aideen gives the impression that there's a lot beneath the surface of idealized pure loveliness.  But maybe there isn't.

Other cases where the pieces aren't all quite there include Jamke, Claude, Briggid, and Ayra.  From the other various authorized sources about Raquesis we can see that we're not getting a fully-realized picture of her in-game, either. Hell, one of the big takeaways about Raquie in Chapter 5 seems to be that she likes shota bait.  :/

Gimmicky:

Dew's kinda cute, actually.  Sucks for me as a unit every time, but his personality grew on me, there seem to be some hints of... something... in Chapter 5.  But, basically, he's wise-cracking shota bait (see above).

Verdict: Fun to write, not very deep.

Other walking gimmicks include Arden.  We can thank him for FE13's Kellam.  Fuck.

Those Two Guys:

I already talked at length about Beowulf and Holyn, the guys who exist purely to make with Raquesis and Ayra and have next to zero relevance in the story.  Of the two, Beowulf appears to be the deeper character.  The designers certainly thought so!

Cipher:

Midayle:  Let me quote from solmedes .  "The way I see it, Midir's entire existence in-game and in-plot is wrapped so completely around Aideen that giving him anything beyond OH LADY AIDEEN~ automatically makes him headcanon instead of base canon."  

Verdict: Cruel but fair, man.

Other offenders in this include Our Lady, Deirdre, whose inner life is... hell, you've got me.  She loves Sigurd but not enough to take his concern for her well-being seriously.  Whatever.  What else is there to her besides one nice little scene with Ethlyn?

The Time-Skip Kiddies:

With Shanan, Oifaye, and Finn, we're intentionally only getting half the story.  Shanan gets some real growth, or at least he fucks up bad and is sorry about it and then steps up to responsibility in Chapter 5.  Oifaye has no development whatsoever until that same scene in Chapter 5.  He's just there.  And Finn actually has the first half of a development arc sketched out pretty well, especially when you take into account that the game bothers to remind us repeatedly about his offscreen exploits commanding half an army or some shit like that.  From the Prologue to Chapter 5, he really did grow up... and then we get the actual payoff to his storyline come Chapter 9.  Not bad.

Next time, we'll actually tackle the Gen 2 ladies.

Comments

[samuraiter]

Kellam: *looks at Arden* "... another spotlight stolen ..."

[mark_asphodel]

Kellam can't catch a break. But he doesn't deserve to. It's inherent in the system.

[kyusil]

Kellam strikes me as one of the better-developed characters, tbh. His "gimmick" actually lends itself to development in a sort of meta sense, as there kind of HAS to be more to a character who is constantly ignored (as opposed to characters who ride their own quirks, if that makes sense). I've found myself pleasantly surprised at the amount of Kellam supports that didn't feel like a waste of text.

But then again, I've liked him since day one, so.

[samuraiter]

(He's my Oswin, my Gilliam. I love my axe-wielders, but I need my walking walls of death.)

[amielleon]

I keep forgetting Kellam exists, which is both terrible and perfect.

Do tell though, which Kellam supports flesh him out? I don't seem to recall any particularly memorable ones.

[mark_asphodel]

Yeah, I'd like to know which ones are the good ones, too, because everything I saw myself about Kellam (Lissa supports come to mind) I found off-putting.

Actually I think the only thing I did like from him was his exchange with Arden in COY3.

[kyusil]

Well, yeah... any of the myriad diarrhea-centric supports are going to reflect badly on the characters involved. :P

[mark_asphodel]

The fact that there are myriad supports about toxic cooking and the effects thereof say a lot to me about where the dev team's head was at.

I just don't recall playing earlier games and thinking, "Boy, what this game really needs is some implied gastrointestinal purges."

[kyusil]

HAHAHA. My thoughts exactly.

[kyusil]

Ahah. This might just end up playing testament to my poor taste... but off the top of my head I think his Donnel supports were the ones where he talks about making a habit of being ignored as a result of his selfish attitude as a kid... either that or they were the ones about how he's representing his little village. Or maybe my memory's just shot. Anyway, his Panne supports are basically about him trying to get her to spar in order to start her talking to others in the group on good terms. Basically we at least know some background for how he acts and there's evidence of him trying to be more thoughtful as a result.

Still, it's probably more of a preference thing than an objectively good/memorable thing.

[amielleon]

I don't recall reading about a selfish attitude there, and looking at the Japanese it doesn't seem to be an element. He does say he didn't talk to people very often as a kid since he was often not noticed, and had a lot of time to spend pondering by himself. And his parents didn't hear his opinions very often.

-- Thinking about it, that kind of adds a new slant to the ending of his Summer Scramble conversation with Henry.

[kyusil]

Hmm, wasn't that one, then. Yeah, I don't remember which it was, but I'm fairly sure it was in an A support somewhere.

[amielleon]

Hey I found it! Nowi B, and I like it too.

[amielleon]

Woops, make that A.

[jsnd]

As sad as this sounds, I think its really clear that the only gen 1 that they actually give a damn about is like.... Finn and Lewyn, considering those two essentially has their own character arcs and the only one that IS actually bothered to canonize comes FE5.
Although it might be more because they actually survived, but..... eh.

Not like gen 2 is any better

Personally, I love how you forgot, or at least did not mention Noish and Alec, showing that Arden's gimmick is, in fact make him more notable then both of them.

I suppose they are the "Gimmicky" type? Their only reason of existence seems to be "they are on Sigurd's starting squad alongside Arden", and I suppose "the first of the Chrismas Cavalier with an interaction with each other. Except you won't actually give a damn about them because Sigurd, Finn, and Quan exist and is better than them at anything, so they are stuck as a Breeding stock machine"

[mark_asphodel]

Even if Lewyn died in Ch5 and stayed dead he'd still have better characterization than just about anyone else in the damn game. Adult!Lewyn makes him a truly great character in FE canon, but he was already on the top of the heap as far as this game goes.

I do think the unequal treatment of characters shows favoritism but it's a bit of a chicken-and-egg issue on where that favoritism comes from. We know that Jamke got more screen time than he was supposed to because Kaga (I think) developed a soft spot for him, and yet what we got on Jamke in the end doesn't feel like enough. And as much as I feel Shanan got shafted someone on the dev team thought it'd be funny to inflict a Fake Shanan on us not once, but twice! And clearly SOMEBODY thought Beowulf was awesome. But yeah, I do think someone or multiple somebodies was writing this thing going "Yeeaaaaah, Lewyn!" and "Yeeeah, Leif!" and so on.

[This is why the question of "Why does Thracia 776 exist?" is interesting, because the dev team chose to illuminate and expand a story that already got a shocking amount of screen time in FE4 and to lavish extra development on characters that already had some of the best development in FE4. It's not like they gave us Agustria 779: The Revenge of The Black Knight, after all. So did the Thracia stuff seem like the best material, or was it the best material because it was what Kaga and crew were most invested in, or what? It sure looks like the latter.]

Re: Alec and Noish. I wasn't sure if they transcended their respective gimmicks or not. Arden most certainly does not. Alec and Noish are indeed One-Note-Johnnies in any event. I also didn't touch on Lex, Tiltyu, or Fury. Do we get enough on Fury to understand her? Maybe. Is there more to Lex than what we see? Is Tiltyu really that stupid? Not sure.

[amielleon]

Speaking of the major stand-outs, Alvis ain't playable but he deserves at least an honorable mention for having an incredible character arc between the generations.

[mark_asphodel]

I think the villains and NPCs are gonna get their own post.

Partly for Arvis and Travant and partly so I can defend Eldigan's logic again.

[raphiael]

I liked Fury a lot in the Oosawa manga. I can't recall exactly why. I don't remember being particularly impressed by her in the game script, though.

[mark_asphodel]

Fury is an interesting case to me because I've wondered how her in-game presence would be interpreted if she weren't female. I mean, she shows up as SRS BZNS knight doing knight stuff (I like her dialogue with Sigurd) but then IMMEDIATELY her characterization goes into "Who's Sylvia?" and is basically all "I want into Lewyn's pants!" up until she, uh, gets into Lewyn's pants.

[Mind, she's supposed to be the more graceful and demure candidate for getting into Lewyn's pants, whereas "Sylvie" is openly aggressive, but they're equally obvious.]

I just have to wonder if genderswapped Fury with the Lewyn's-pants angle toned down a hair would feel more acceptable because, hey, ingrained double standard for judging female characters.

[amielleon]

I think it's a little harsh to call Shannan's mistake in Ch 3 a fuck up. In terms of consequences, yeah, but no one has any reason to anticipate what happens to Deedee there. Hell, she'd been prancing around a battlefield a few years ago. Sigurd's orders to keep her in the castle had nothing to do with why she was captured, and poor Shannan gets left with guilt about a freak accident that he, as a kid, didn't have much ability to prevent by persuasion anyway.

[mark_asphodel]

In real-world terms, Shanan's a kid who couldn't stop a freak kidnapping. But in the Celtic fairy-tale sense that surrounds a lot of what goes on with Deirdre in particular, I think there is an element of culpability to Shanan there-- again, not in any rational, legal or modern sense, but in the way this mythical world operates. He makes a promise to Sigurd that he, personally, won't let any harm come to Deirdre or Seliph. It's a promise he really had no business making and one he can't keep, but there you are.

(Shanan's insistence of keeping custody of Seliph because of his promise to Deirdre has a similiar whiff of Celtic fairytale to it. Unbreakable vows and irrational rules and oaths sworn to pretty mystic ladies are such a big part of things in Celtic myth that suspect it's intentional.)

I mean, ultimately it's all Sigurd's fault for not being able to keep his trousers buttoned by hey, fate.

[amielleon]

Huh. All right, I can agree with that.

Kaga, man.